We covered psychological operations (psyops) in an article last month.
Bloggers responding to that thread mentioned that psyops are illegal if they are conducted on Americans (wink, wink - as if making bank robbery illegal stopped bank robbery).
The Mainstream Media (MSM) has now come clean and said what we have been blogging for years:
The Bush administration turned the U.S. military into a global propaganda machine while imposing tough restrictions on journalists seeking to give the public truthful reports about the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, Associated Press chief executive Tom Curley said Friday.(Huffington Post, emphasis added). That begs the question "don't we have rules that prevent the military from being a propaganda machine which uses the American press to promulgate its propaganda"?
Curley, speaking to journalists at the University of Kansas, said the news industry must immediately negotiate a new set of rules for covering war because "we are the only force out there to keep the government in check and to hold it accountable."
Our current national schizophrenia would produce the "answer" yes and no, which is what a past president warned us about.
The next post in this series is here.
The most honest statement by a journalist came from an Iraqi. http://shoe08.blogspot.com
ReplyDeleteBut the problems with "bias" in the media didn't start with G.W. After all, if there was no massacre in Tiananmen Sq why did all the journalists make it up? And why don't they correct the story, now that the documents have been declassified?
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/eo20080721gc.html
Hi Kathy,
ReplyDeleteThank you for presenting another facet of an issue.
While I can't say that the Japan Times article proves there was no 'massacre' in that Chinese city by rhetorically calling it a 'riot' instead of a 'massacre', the article seems to want to do that:
In the panicky fighting afterward, hundreds, maybe even thousands, of civilians and students were killed. But that was a riot, not a deliberate massacre. And it did not happen in Tiananmen Square. So why all the reports of a "massacre"?
(Japan Times, emphasis added). Semantics and rhetoric we must use, but how one sees events is the context that gives the most meaning.
If in LA, Seattle, or NY "hundreds, maybe thousands" of "civilians and students" were killed by police calling it a riot instead of a massacre would go nowhere. Our people see it differently than Chinese see it, and that is what makes it an American context.
We still talk about Kent State whether it is called a massacre or a riot. It was the first "Tiananmen Square".
But whether something is first, fifth, or last is not relevant in this context.
Is the first bank robbery to be cited by the bank robber who robbed the third bank as a means of exoneration? "I wasn't the first judge". How about the first rape vs the seventh rape?
"G.W. did not rob the first bank and therefore he is not a bad of a bank robber as the guy who robbed the first bank"? If Bush II is the second to use propaganda in a very un-American way is he exonerated because Nixon did it first? Not only no, but hell no.
Flaky premises lead to flaky deductions, and false premises lead to false deductions.
Nevertheless I appreciate the view from another vantage point, and it does add some understanding of what happened that terrible day.
Thanks for showing that there are some journalists who view those events differently than other journalists.
Kathy,
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of Iraqi journalists, have you read Riverbend blog ... commonly called 'Baghdad Burning'?
She is (or maybe was, we don't know ... last heard of her Oct 2007) an Iraqi blogger.
Will propaganda turn the Madagascar killings into a riot or a massacre?
ReplyDeleteIt depends on who is talking and who is listening.
From even a quick look at Kathy's website, I have some quick questions for her already.
ReplyDeleteShe posts a video where an angry Israeli settler claims that Jews had killed Jesus and were proud of it. Wasn't it the Romans who killed Jesus?
And even if those who killed Jesus were Jewish, is it fair to blame a whole religion for his death?
Then I see Kathy wrote the following:
"I myself have experienced this kind of persecution, for expressing my views on the current catastrophy in Palestine. Nakba continues, but the Holocost is over."
The holocost? That is a way holocaust deniers spell the word. She also made that statement in a post centered around the new Pope with Opus Dei and Nazi ties. She praises Pope Benedict XVI for his expressing of the Christian value of forgiveness.
I see on the left side she has a link to a post comparing Nazi versus Israeli removals.
Here's one post I found of hers where she makes the claim that it is a logical leap for many to go from hating the draconian policies of Israel to hating all people of Jewish faith.
It does not take long to go from hating what Israel does, to hating Israel.
"And, acording to reports, some have moved on to the next steo, hating Zionists. For many, distinguishing between Israel's actions and Israel, and distinguishing between Zionists and Jews is too hard for them to grasp. Thta is why, in my opinion, Israel's actions in Gaza now is so dangerous, not only to the Palestinians and Israeli's, but to all Americans, as we supply the bombs, and to all Jews, because they share the same religious values as does Israel.
To recognize how this works, one need not go any further that @Chris Berel's comment, above. He wrote..."nothing will ever change as long as Palestinians teach hatred in their homes, streets, schools, and mosques."
Aside from the gross generalization, stereotyping, which is the foundation of all racism and discrimination, I would still have to ask, are Israeli's also taught to hate?
Perhaps we need a better understanding of just what is hatred, how is is visited into our hearts and minds, and how we can recover from its blinding power.
take care, Kathy"
This may sound reasonable on the surface. But why does she write 'holocost', highlight one fool saying he is proud that 'the Jews killed Jesus', praise the new Pope, equate Israeli oppression of Palestinians with that of Hitler, and say that it makes sense for people to hate Jews because of the Israeli government, since they share the same religion?
So how did Kathy find the DreddBlog? Would she perhaps feel more at home with Biggie BigDan, Agent99, Plunger, and NoMoreWarsForIsrael?
Dredd, I am not trying to start trouble or try to steer your moderating. If you ever feel the need to give me a censure, I will take it to heart. Yet, just a quick look into Kathy's internet activities has me wondering whether she realises that you do not want hate on your website.
The link on the right side provided by Dredd looks like a good one.
ReplyDeletePropaganda
That link is a treasure trove. Thanks Dreddster. From reading through that, one can get to the following:
ReplyDeleteOffice of Strategic Information
How has the Rendon Group and subsequently the US Military not broken the law against practicing psychological operations on American citizens?
socrates,
ReplyDeleteGood work bro.
It is difficult sometimes, because we were born into a sea of propaganda from day one and have been exposed to it for a lifetime, to detect propaganda.
ReplyDeleteLike a ghost it is sometimes better to try to detect the effects it has.
Italy is going through its version of our Terry Schiavo nightmare which set off the republicans in congress, causing them to do a major bill that changed federal jurisdiction practically overnight. Then Bush II hurriedly flew in from Texas to sign it.
At this moment in Italy a woman has been in a vegetative state coma for 17 years. Her father wants to carry out what he calls her will, and pull the plug. He won in court to have it done but the other part of government is in rebellion to that decision.
Italy is having a constitutional crisis over it, one branch of government at ultimate odds with another, breaking the law by refusing to adhere to the court decision. After talking with the Vatican about it.
The religious propaganda at play can be detected by first noting how wonderful heaven is said to be in religious dogma of that country, and that this woman is slated to go there. Paradise was just ahead. Instead of wanting her to be in blissful paradise forever they want her to stay rotting in a hospital bed.
Ask yourself why would they put themselves into a constitutional crisis by not letting her go on to paradise as they see it on the one hand, and instead keeping her as a vegetable here on the other hand?
Why does the Vatican not want to let her go on to paradise?
Sounds like someone has been reading a lot of religious text with some strange propaganda in it, but has not grasped that there is a lack of any common sense or consistency in this picture.
Like Bob Dylan said "you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows".
I think it is a case were religious propaganda does not make sense yet it effected the very government of a county. Sound familiar?
Reminds me of a joke a preacher told me one time. It goes like this:
ReplyDeleteA preacher was giving a fiery 'lets go to heaven!' sermon, and had built up a ground swell of support with 'amens' and 'hallelujahs' proliferating in the little church building.
Once he had it at maximum high pitch, the fervent preacher cried out 'stand up if you want to go to heaven'. He noticed a man still sitting in the front row pew, the only parishioner not standing and gyrating with the crowd.
He quickly stopped the sermon, the crowd came to a hush, and he asked 'young man, don't you want to go to heaven'?
The young man sheepishly stood up, and raised his eyes slowly to meet the pastor's eyes. He said 'pastor, I thought you were getting up a load to go right now' ...
While waiting for Kathy to respond....
ReplyDeleteThe Terry Schiavo story seemed to be a prime example where propagandists used it to divert attention away from more important issues. Such insidious forces realise it is next to impossible to prove they are paid fakes. That's how they get away with it.
This guy I proved was cyberstalking me at BradBlog, he had made a post on this years back. He asked, "Why does Michael want Terri to die?"
2004, Psychiatric Expert Witness profiles Michael Schiavo
Topics: Terri Schiavo's Life Counts
Posted by: Louis Aubuchont at March 22, 2005 9:49 PM
"WHO IS Michael Schiavo? What does he do for a living, now?
Why hasn't he been charged with attempted murder, spousal abuse, polygamy, fraud...
WHY does Michael want Terri to die?"
Referring to terms provided by the link on propaganda, that thread included many examples of name calling, glittering generalities, plain folks, bandwagon, and card stacking techniques.
socrates,
ReplyDeleteAt Bradblog I have criticized Robert Kennedy Jr., a man I like and respect very, very much, for doing a qui tam suit when Gonzales was Attorney General.
Agent99 immediately jumped on me mercilessly for that. I explained that in a qui tam you show your hand to them, you give all the evidence you have to the government, and the complaint, etc., and they normally take 90 days to say whether they will join and carry the ball or not.
Once they say they won't carry the ball, you can then go ahead with the case without them.
I explained that they were telling the fox how they were going to try to help the chickens. I said they will sit on it, ask for more evidence, more about the case, etc., because they were not the people's DOJ, they were as I coined it The Department of Just Us, and they will stall.
That is exactly what happened. A year or so after stalling and getting as much evidence as they could to help the fox, they said we don't want the case.
Now the plaintiffs are loosing out on that case (it involves Conelly too).
The greatest problem the democrats have is that they are very, very, very naive about who they are dealing with in the republicans.
Robert Kennedy Jr. who is a wonderful social human being was handled in that case like Leopold was. And it may have happened again.
He has been an advocate of a notion the vaccines for children cause autism. It now comes out that a doctor who started that theory is being accused of doctoring documents.
I hope we realize that the deceit business is so vast that each and every one of us is damaged by it at times.
They deliberately set people up to neutralize and slander them. Every day.
Hi Dredd,
ReplyDelete"Agent99 immediately jumped on me mercilessly for that. I explained that in a qui tam you show your hand to them, you give all the evidence you have to the government, and the complaint, etc., and they normally take 90 days to say whether they will join and carry the ball or not."
BradBlog and the Biggie Big Dan places are all about the bandwagon technique. They got tired of your nuanced approach to things. For them, it's either their way or the highway.
They don't want people to get the full picture, hence the card stacking.
You are a million times more knowledgeable on the election integrity reform topics than me and many, many people. Again, the 99's don't want anyone to get the full picture. You could probably explain to newbies the different versions of the Holt bill, the pros and cons. Or you could dissect voter by mail. You are able to respect RFK Jr. yet still critique his positions.
There was a reporter named Joseph Lauria who had his identity stolen by Jason Leopold. Lauria has written a book with Mike Gravel and is clearly a progressive journalist who crosses t's and dots i's. But when the Leopold thing came out, the bandwagon dismissed the sheer truth of what Leopold had done, and somehow implied that Lauria must be on the Karl Rove payroll. Bandwagon and card stacking.
When TroubleinWinter made that Uh-Oh that guy thread a few years back on Kimberlin, it was Larisa who jumped into the fray declaring that Brett had been an exonerated, ex-political prisoner. She said he had even won money for this, and the deal was he couldn't speak about the details. Then a peanut gallery member showed up with the typical we love you lala_rawraw.
It's hard to know who is a willing disinfo peddler from who has been duped. No way RFK Jr. is a paid fake. Which takes me to what you said here:
"I hope we realize that the deceit business is so vast that each and every one of us is damaged by it at times."
We are all vulnernable to being duped. There's no way in my mind that Lori Grace or any of the others funding the Speedway Bomber are paid fakes. She is old enough to have been a hippie. She is into New Age material and is clearly trying to do what she feels is for the best. The cards are simply being stacked. That is why I have been sticking my big mouth out as much as possible to deprogram those taken in by BK.
Yet, some people I do find it hard to believe that they don't realise his past. Multiple numbers of reporters have contacted Arnebeck and asked him to look into his history. Now how is a guy like that gonna be duped by BK? What about Brad? How can he not know the truth about him, Ben Burch, Slu&&o? How can he still be linking to Leopold?
Is Leopold a paid fake? I don't know. He could be someone with mental problems who is being manipulated. Wayne Madsen? I had always thought he was a paid fake. But perhaps he is a poor slob doing whatever he can to survive. So the paid fakes know these types are vulnerable, and they feed them whatever they want knowing that these guys have no gravitas to separate wheat from chaff.
So the question becomes, is someone misinformed, or are they disinfo?
I have written lots of stuff that I now regret. Thankfully, based on my educational training, I was able to leave wiggle room.
There have been few and far between the number of people I have called out as probably being paid fakes. At certain points and with certain individuals, I have felt the right to argue the possibility.
I have never said that Brett Kimberlin is Cointelpro. That would be a ludicrous statement to make. But I have written that it isn't a far-fetched idea to consider the possibility. Who would ever get the idea to forge DoD insignia? Who would have the kinds of weapons and explosives that were found in his possession? How does someone go from prisoner to internet icon in just a few years?
What about Larisa and Agent99? We are not the only ones to have wondered about them. But are they willing disinfo? I think they are. But it's near impossible to say it as 100% fact.
"They deliberately set people up to neutralize and slander them. Every day."
I made one of my best posts ever at Debate Both Sides last night but now fear that it is gone forever. The website has been down for many hours now. I can see one cache of a two page thread but it stops before my good post. The page two shows as having a cache, but when I click on it, I get the not available page from google.
I did something which I refer to as a reverse troll. I have alluded here and there about my story, and I admit on the surface it must sound outrageous.
Picture if you were more like me. Say you went on a crusade and studied the Biggie Big Dan, Agent99, Brad, all the people you have come across who you now may suspect have had insidious or selfish agendas the whole time. Say you took screenshots, you went the whole nine yards showing that more likely than not these are paid trolls or misinformation.
Then you would be under the kind of attacks I have been under for two years. But you seem much more grounded than me, not so quick to get bogged down in some goofy, esoteric, trollbusting mode.
Anyway, it has gotten to the point where the good guys, myself and this guy Lophofo, have gained the upper hand on the bad guys. It has gotten to the point where I am reaching out to reporters and am telling all I know about how the bad guys have been truly busted. Since you are not like me in this respect, you merely got a few zingers thrown your way, that you are Mossad or that you get banned and stalk people. The difference is, the attacks on me have never ended. They never let up.
If you want, I will send you clips of a phone call that Lophofo received at his company workplace. Yes, these buggers have actually taken the cyberstalking crap and tried to intimidate us in the real world. But it has utterly backfired.
A bit of the back story:
About a month or two ago, my co-founder/admin Lophofo went nuts on me. I didn't know why. I had no other option than to delete his account. But then we found a way to communicate. We each gave the other every opportunity to explain wtf was going on. In short, insidious forces have been portraying me as part of a disinfo script. Lophofo had every reason to think I was part of it.
The other guy, the one I mentioned above, and who I am sure you have seen his name mentioned with Will Thomas and something called Deep Sky, has been an obvious nutjob. But extraordinary efforts have been made to make it appear that I have also been in on it.
Lophofo has been getting attacks on both his home and work computers. One day a phone call was received by a co-worker/friend of his who has been following everything. The caller said he was ex-intelligence, and that the NS& cannot be beaten and can crack anyone.
Lophofo at first sent me a clip or two from the phone call. It sounded like it was from a radio show. But the more questions I asked Lophofo, and the more I answered his, we started to see that an elaborate divide and conquer plan was in effect to drive a wedge between us.
I finally asked him what the phone call had to do with chemtrails or me. The last clip he sent was incredible. His friend mentioned how his co-worker {Lophofo} seemed to be on an NS& watch list. He mentioned HAARP which he pronounced as HAARPA, he mentioned chemtrails. The guy with a Northeastern accent purporting to be ex-intelligence let out a nervous laugh. He had just realised that it wasn't Lophofo he had been talking with for over a half hour. He first acts stupid about HAARP, then he switches gears as if he is aware of it.
Long story short, I will send you these clips. I have already sent them to reporters.
Last night at DBS, like I said, I did my reverse-troll thing. Lou has been saying that I am famed debunker Jay Reynolds, the guy with ties to conspiracy theorist William Cooper of all people. It was a brilliant post, but unfortunately I think it has now been scrubbed. If not, I will amend this comment.
Basically, we believe that Aubuchont either made the call himself or is well aware of it. I facetiously admitted to being Jay Reynolds. I basically psyopped a disinfo creep. I told him he had gotten the triple ouchie. One, he hadn't been talking with Lophofo, hence there are multiple witnesses. Two, the phone call was taped. Three, an assortment of reporters and others are now aware of what we have been put through.
We are at the point where we are saying there are two Captain Kirks, that we admit to that. We are telling the world this. All of this is simply too elaborate to be a troll in the basement. Lophofo is good with computers. He has been getting military ip's trying to get into his files. He says he has secured the evidence. We have, in short, spooked a spook. We have beaten them at their own game.
I want to send you a couple clips. Then you will see that something bizarre is going on. Then it comes down to whether you think we are using you for some script to discredit your website, progressives, and the internet in a Jason leopold/Larisa-ish type experience, or whether we indeed are on the brink of breaking a major story.
There is a cautionary tale to all this in the name of Sean Dix. He had come up with an invention for people with arthritis and skin problems to be able to floss pain free. He agreed to have CNN do a segment, thinking he would get an endorsement. However, he was instead ambushed with a hatchet job on his worthy product. It ruined his business prospects.
So I realise that we need to be careful in how we get our story out. There will be people who will try to marginalise us as crackpots.
Sean Dix reacted the wrong way. That is one mistake we will never make. We are law abiding and non-violent. But this is a true story which begs the Nancy Kerrigan question. Whyyyy? Why me? {us}.
I want to send you a couple of clips from the phone call. I am also gonna have to figure out which reporters are intrepid and which are hacks. I do believe that the more people aware of our experience, the safer we are.
We are at the point where the beans have been cooked and are ready to be spilled. I know this must all sound so very outrageous. Maybe folks are thinking all the Captain Kirks are fake. That is why at a certain point, for anything effective to come out of the internet, we must apply it to the real world.
I know what the dark side is thinking. They must be in a complete daze that their phone call stunt was recorded. They must be in a daze that both myself and Lophofo are not afraid to step forward in the real world. They must be in a daze that there are now multiple witnesses, reporters, family, and friends who are well aware of what is going on. I warned these people a long time ago that they'd be better off ignoring me. They should have taken that advice.
I believe these are rogue forces. I am not a conspiracy theorist.
socrates,
ReplyDeleteThe path to this has one landmine. Taping a phone call, unless it is a message recording where they knew they would be taped, or unless they were informed it was being taped can be an invasion of privacy. There may be an exception when they are making a threat.
Read this. The circumstances must be analyzed, including the state law where the call was recorded, and federal law.
Journalists can publish it if they do not know it is illegally recorded, and there are other scenarios.
Whattaya think?
socrates,
ReplyDeleteRead this. It talks about state laws involved.
socrates,
ReplyDeleteThe more I read your post, the more I think it can be validly disclosed.
I read several Court cases, one which is very close to these facts Jean v. Massachusetts State Police, 492 F.3d 24 (1st Cir. 2007), which cites Bartnicki v. Vopper, 532 U.S. 514 (2001).
So if you write an article about it, including relevant quotes from the conversations I will publish it as a guest article.
Thanks for reading through that long-winded post I wrote.
ReplyDeleteIt appears that DBS didn't actually delete anything. An announcement says, "Thank you for your patience these past several hours. We've updated the forums and moved them to our new hosting equipment..."
So Lophofo offers the possiblity that DBS has been redirecting its domain to a third party military server, then a few weeks later, DBS is moved to new hosting equipment? I've emailed Lophofo and given him a link to this specific thread. Hopefully, he can chime in.
From one of your links, it appears that Massachusetts is one of twelve states where all parties must consent to the tape recording. Thankfully, Utah is not one of them.
I would like to find intrepid lawyers and reporters who are willing to take a good look into this convoluted situation. We don't want these beans to bake into a crisp.
Sean Dix had the right idea but used the wrong methods after CNN had hung him out to dry. He shouldn't have overloaded their fax machines, and he definitely shouldnn't have threatened Ted Turner's life. But I think he was correct to try to get CNN's or the world's attention to how he had been wronged by the segment ridiculing his floss invention.
I was almost to the point where I was quite content to be seen as the kooky chemmie who had ended up in some enigmatic blog war with neo-nazis and people faking themselves as being chemtrail activists. But this phone call has crossed the line into real life.
There was a poster at DBS a few years back named winger_ace who threatened someone known as Fair &Balanced Who Cares along with his family. FBWC then went to a marine website winger_ace was at, gained people's trust there, then found out the guy's real name. He turned out to be making his hate posts while working out of a Taunton, Massachusetts government office.
I recently put up links at DBS explaining that story to let these other people know that there are certain lines that should never be crossed on the internet. It's one thing to call someone an a$$hat, stuff like that, it's quite another to terrorise people in real life.
It's easy for me to prove that I have been under a sophisticated cybersmear/stalking attack the last few years. Yet, this phone call has certainly upped the ante. Why couldn't these people just leave us alone? If I am a disruptor who has turned into the debunkers' best friend, why not just leave it at that? Why stalk me at BradBlog? Why make that phone call?
Lophofo has explained that it took a number of calls before the person actually reached his friend. Other previous untraceable calls had come in from someone showing an interest in signing up with their company.
I was caught off-guard when Lophofo first turned on me. I was busy at DU with that long thread on BK which eventually was deleted.
When I heard the part about chemtrails and HAARP, I finally understood that this had been an attempt to scare Lophofo into not only distrusting me but to perhaps also steer him into giving up on figuring out chemtrails and how to get the public aware of them, and to rather stick to taking care of his job and family.
I'm gonna send you two clips. One will be where the guy is talking about the NS&. The second one will be where the co-worker brings in the chemtrails, HAARP, etc.. You have to hear it to understand how warped a situation two nobodies have found themselves involved in.
I think all this attention I've received is proof chemtrails are real. I can ultimately prove I am sincere. Then the obvious question becomes, why won't they just leave this kid {me} alone?